Mouse issue on XMBC : Scroll jumping

x64 Replacement/Alternative to Microsoft's IntelliMouse application.
Forum rules
Please read the forum rules before posting for the first time.
The more information you can provide, the quicker and more accurately someone can help.
NOTE: To reduce spam, new users can not post links, files or images until they have at least 4 posts.
x3koizumi
New User
Posts: 10
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2022 5:25 am

Mouse issue on XMBC : Scroll jumping

Post by x3koizumi »

XMBC Version: 2.19.2
Windows Version: 10
Mouse Information (brand/model): netway gaming mouse
Relevant Computer Information (CPU, RAM etc): lenovo gaming laptop (i7/16GB)
Did the problem occur after an upgrade of XMBC? (If so, from what version?): nope
Did the problem occur after a Windows update/upgrade? (If so, from what version?): nope
How long have you used XMBC?: some months
What language and keyboard layout do you use in Windows?: ES

Clear description of the problem - try and include as much information as possible, including what button and mappings you are having problems with (if applicable).:

I found some scroll issues on the forum, but not this specific one:

When XMBC is activated, scroll movements are erratic. It causes random jumps when you stop scrolling. Sometimes it does scrolls for some seconds.This erratic behaviour stops when I disable the XMBC on the tray icon.

I tried changing different settings related to scroll, but I just don't know what to do, because I don't understand what the problem is.

Any help will be appreciated.

EDIT:

Maybe it was just my imagination, but, I noticed that the random scroll jumps may happen when other mouse events are triggered. I'm not sure.
x3koizumi
New User
Posts: 10
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2022 5:25 am

Re: Mouse issue on XMBC : Scroll jumping

Post by x3koizumi »

Update: I kept the xbmc main window opened while trying to reproduce the issue. I reproduced the problem, and I can confirm that the wheel UP button on the app highlighted when it happened, while I didn't roll the wheel.

I have two theories:
1) It's been triggered by other mouse events. (?¿)
2) XBMC is not managing correctly the sensitivity value for the events wheelUP/WheelDOWN.

Ideas?
User avatar
phil
Site Admin
Posts: 7627
Joined: Sun Apr 06, 2003 11:12 pm

Re: Mouse issue on XMBC : Scroll jumping

Post by phil »

3. The scroll wheel is dirty and sending erratic messages....

Not really sure what to suggest and this doesn't happen normally. XMBC hooks windows messages - so if its seeing something, something has put said message into Windows. The messages are different for the scroll wheel and other things (movement and button presses) so its unlikely that any other mouse action is causing a scroll message.

XMBC sees messages, the sensitivity is irrelevant - either the message is there (and XMBC sees it) or it is not there.
Sure XMBC could take some time seeing it and deciding what to do - but, assuming you have not remapped scroll (??) its very fast to decide to leave it be.

Did you try disabling the "Scroll window under cursor" option that's the most likely to cause problems and isn't really needed these days on Windows 10 and later.

You could enable debug logging, but this will only confirm what you have seen in the log file - it wont tell you the source of the messages (as windows mouse message hooking does not include any source device (or source software) information).

You could also PM (or email) me a copy of your profile, so I can have a look and make sure its OK here with my devices and that its not a configuration issue.
--[ Phil ]--
--[ Administrator & XMBC Author ]--
Logitech G9/G604/M720/MX518, Microsoft Intellimouse, Trust 16341 BT Mouse
Windows 10 x64, AMD Ryzen 5900x, MSI x570 Tomahawk, 32GB DDR4,
nVidia RTX 2070s, Evo 970 1Tb NVME, 2x2TB WD Black (RAID1)
x3koizumi
New User
Posts: 10
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2022 5:25 am

Re: Mouse issue on XMBC : Scroll jumping

Post by x3koizumi »

phil wrote: Sun Jan 09, 2022 11:07 am 3. The scroll wheel is dirty and sending erratic messages....

Not really sure what to suggest and this doesn't happen normally. XMBC hooks windows messages - so if its seeing something, something has put said message into Windows. The messages are different for the scroll wheel and other things (movement and button presses) so its unlikely that any other mouse action is causing a scroll message.

XMBC sees messages, the sensitivity is irrelevant - either the message is there (and XMBC sees it) or it is not there.
Sure XMBC could take some time seeing it and deciding what to do - but, assuming you have not remapped scroll (??) its very fast to decide to leave it be.

Did you try disabling the "Scroll window under cursor" option that's the most likely to cause problems and isn't really needed these days on Windows 10 and later.

You could enable debug logging, but this will only confirm what you have seen in the log file - it wont tell you the source of the messages (as windows mouse message hooking does not include any source device (or source software) information).

You could also PM (or email) me a copy of your profile, so I can have a look and make sure its OK here with my devices and that its not a configuration issue.

Hi Phil, thanks for your message. Actually, it's happening less often than before. But it's still happening.

I don't know what settnig did help, but this is what I have:
Added config for Chrome. Activate Scroll Method 1.

Make scroll wheel scroll under cursor: NO
Bypass ALL actions when SCROLL LOCK is ON: yes
Also all Reset sticky options: YES
Ignore mouse events from touch: YES

And that's all.

No mappings on scroll .And the mouse is relatively new, I don't think it's dirty.

My impression is that when scroll is triggered from the wheel, if something else is triggered on the mouse before I stop the scroll, the scroll keeps happening for a while. It's like the "STOP" scrolling can't be processed at the moment there's another event. I don't know if this makes sense, I'm describint what I feel when the issue happens.

Thanks for the help.
User avatar
phil
Site Admin
Posts: 7627
Joined: Sun Apr 06, 2003 11:12 pm

Re: Mouse issue on XMBC : Scroll jumping

Post by phil »

My impression is that when scroll is triggered from the wheel, if something else is triggered on the mouse before I stop the scroll, the scroll keeps happening for a while. It's like the "STOP" scrolling can't be processed at the moment there's another event. I don't know if this makes sense, I'm describing what I feel when the issue happens.
If this were a button, with a distinct DOWN and UP action, I could imagine another mouse action causing a small delay, but scroll is different. It does not send a down and up message, just a single "scroll" message with a delta which indicates how many notches on the wheel were scrolled.

Now, particularly with smooth scrolling, it sends many of these messages, they repeat while scrolling is happening - so the more messages sent, the more XMBC gets in the way (as it has to inspect every single message and decide what to do with it). So if it is getting flooded with messages, they may still be being processed when you stop scrolling, and they will continue to be processed - because they are still there - maybe this is what you are experiencing...

If you enable debug logging, you will see in the log file just how many scroll messages XMBC is processing (this will probably slow down XMBC and make matters worse while logging is enabled - perhaps a good test on its own to see if that is the case).

Turning off the various scroll options (like scroll window under the cursor) will help as it will reduce the amount XMBC has to do for each message.
But turning on the scroll option "Method 1" for chrome, will cause XMBC to translated EVERY message received into a WM_SCROLL message that will be posted to the chrome window.

XMBC does have a "throttle" which will "ignore" repeated messages that come in very quickly - but this may be bypassed if you have explicitly set to use method 1 (its been ages since I looked at this so I'm not 100% sure).

Adding other mouse messages will of course cause further delay, but it should not be significant.

So my question, why would you want to do this, rather than leaving as "default" which will simply let the original mouse message through (much quicker)?

I'm going to try setting up a similar chrome profile and see if I see the same thing here..
--[ Phil ]--
--[ Administrator & XMBC Author ]--
Logitech G9/G604/M720/MX518, Microsoft Intellimouse, Trust 16341 BT Mouse
Windows 10 x64, AMD Ryzen 5900x, MSI x570 Tomahawk, 32GB DDR4,
nVidia RTX 2070s, Evo 970 1Tb NVME, 2x2TB WD Black (RAID1)
User avatar
phil
Site Admin
Posts: 7627
Joined: Sun Apr 06, 2003 11:12 pm

Re: Mouse issue on XMBC : Scroll jumping

Post by phil »

Update - just tried it here with chrome (latest) and method 1 - no obvious problems/erratic scrolling.
Is it worse on any particular websites (I just scrolled up and down a google search result list)?
Didn't seem to make any difference moving the mouse or clicking buttons at the same time/just after scrolling either.

Your PC spec looks like its not going to be a problem (not quite as high as my desktop where I tried this - I'll try it on my laptop which is also I7/16Gb just in case)

EDIT: no problem on the laptop either...
--[ Phil ]--
--[ Administrator & XMBC Author ]--
Logitech G9/G604/M720/MX518, Microsoft Intellimouse, Trust 16341 BT Mouse
Windows 10 x64, AMD Ryzen 5900x, MSI x570 Tomahawk, 32GB DDR4,
nVidia RTX 2070s, Evo 970 1Tb NVME, 2x2TB WD Black (RAID1)
x3koizumi
New User
Posts: 10
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2022 5:25 am

Re: Mouse issue on XMBC : Scroll jumping

Post by x3koizumi »

It looks the issues are gone or at least can't appreciate any jump for some time.

Maybe you're right on the event messages flooding.

I'll change method back to default, and see.

Thank you so much! :cheers:
x3koizumi
New User
Posts: 10
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2022 5:25 am

Re: Mouse issue on XMBC : Scroll jumping

Post by x3koizumi »

Happened again. Now is a bit random.

I'm sending you the logs.
x3koizumi
New User
Posts: 10
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2022 5:25 am

Re: Mouse issue on XMBC : Scroll jumping

Post by x3koizumi »

For reference in the future for any user that find this thread, this is the last update:

I also deactivated the profile switching on mouse move feature to help lower the events messages.

It looks that deactivating both this feature and the make schroll wheel scrollwindows under cursor, helpded a lot.

The issue is not totally gone, but reduced those jumps drastically.
x3koizumi
New User
Posts: 10
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2022 5:25 am

Re: Mouse issue on XMBC : Scroll jumping

Post by x3koizumi »

Hi, this is still happening, and now I'm conviced that it's that thing you said about xbmc being flooded by action messages.

Is there any other feature that it's safe to deactivate to lower the volume of mouse actions messages?

Thanks.
User avatar
phil
Site Admin
Posts: 7627
Joined: Sun Apr 06, 2003 11:12 pm

Re: Mouse issue on XMBC : Scroll jumping

Post by phil »

The only other "heavy" thing in XMBC is the profile detection for the window under the cursor.
Every time the cursor moves (by more than 2 pixels I think) it looks to see what the window is under the cursor, and if its different from the active profile, it will switch profiles. This is particularly required for window region profiles - they wont work with this switched off)

If you turn off "Enable profile switch on mouse move" that will stop that (but it will also reduce the usefulness of XMBC as the profile will ONLY switch when the active window switches). But its worth a try to see if it makes a difference.

EDIT: Oh you have already tried that... hummm... OK no further ideas... log would be useful but if this is random/rare, its going to be difficult to capture in the log (and/or find it in the log!). If you try this and mange to capture it, be sure to make a note of the time it goes wrong so we can find it more easily in the log!
--[ Phil ]--
--[ Administrator & XMBC Author ]--
Logitech G9/G604/M720/MX518, Microsoft Intellimouse, Trust 16341 BT Mouse
Windows 10 x64, AMD Ryzen 5900x, MSI x570 Tomahawk, 32GB DDR4,
nVidia RTX 2070s, Evo 970 1Tb NVME, 2x2TB WD Black (RAID1)
x3koizumi
New User
Posts: 10
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2022 5:25 am

Re: Mouse issue on XMBC : Scroll jumping

Post by x3koizumi »

I see...

The thing is that the flood happens random, but always when the mouse is moving.
I tried to reproduce the flood doing action the scroll up and down fast, but no luck.

So maybe the flood of messages comes from another component, and not the scroll. Is that possible?

I'm sharing captures of my config just in case you see something wrong.


Screenshot_6.png
Screenshot_7.png
Screenshot_8.png
Screenshot_5.png
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
User avatar
phil
Site Admin
Posts: 7627
Joined: Sun Apr 06, 2003 11:12 pm

Re: Mouse issue on XMBC : Scroll jumping

Post by phil »

Nothing obvious there... You could try turning off all the "change cursor" options on the pointer tab - but as your not using chording/layers/button held etc. it probably wont make any difference.

You could also try the 2.20 beta (available only in the forum beta thread here) just in case I have fixed anything related (again, I doubt it will help but its always worth trying!). The beta is not unstable, its just not quite feature complete enough to become a release version (and does have a little more logging enabled which may be useful in this case!).

Regards,
Phil
--[ Phil ]--
--[ Administrator & XMBC Author ]--
Logitech G9/G604/M720/MX518, Microsoft Intellimouse, Trust 16341 BT Mouse
Windows 10 x64, AMD Ryzen 5900x, MSI x570 Tomahawk, 32GB DDR4,
nVidia RTX 2070s, Evo 970 1Tb NVME, 2x2TB WD Black (RAID1)
x3koizumi
New User
Posts: 10
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2022 5:25 am

Re: Mouse issue on XMBC : Scroll jumping

Post by x3koizumi »

ok thanks, installed.
x3koizumi
New User
Posts: 10
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2022 5:25 am

Re: Mouse issue on XMBC : Scroll jumping

Post by x3koizumi »

still happening...

If the issue happens only when the mouse is moving, what if xbmc is receiving that the wheel middle button is pressed? The scroll UI is not appearing on the screen when the jumps happens, but the behaviour can be explained if the scroll is activated with the middle button.

Does this makes sense?
Post Reply