XMBC 2.14 Beta

x64 Replacement/Alternative to Microsoft's IntelliMouse application.
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phil
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Re: XMBC 2.14 Beta

Post by phil » Sat Oct 01, 2016 7:15 pm

I think I found a major problem in the tabs that might be causing the excessive CPU usage and drawing issues... Ive managed to reduce it significantly - I hope that fixes the drawing too -we shall see.

I think 2.15 beta might be just around the corner :).
--[ Phil ]--
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Logitech G9, Logitech MX518, Microsoft Intellimouse, Trust 16341 BT Mouse
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injtsvetkov
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Re: XMBC 2.14 Beta

Post by injtsvetkov » Sat Oct 01, 2016 11:20 pm

Happy to hear that :!:

Can't wait to see :)

I just wanna say a few words about beta testing. This is the first time I take part in beta testing (I'm using XMBC since v2.12.1 but unfortunately I've missed the 2.13 beta phase :() and I see there are only a handful of people participating, which is a shame considering the 1700 registered users in this forum (not to mention the not registered ones). I was thinking of a way to draw some more users to this (e.g. if I knew beta testing was so interesting when I installed v2.12.1 I wouldn't have missed 2.13 beta phase) and hopefully improve the beta testing process.

Have you thought about enabling the 'Check for beta versions' option by default and maybe some kind of notification that it is enabled so the user can decide whether to turn it off after the installation. Or maybe put it in the last page of the installer under the 'Run XMBC now' option together with something like: ''Your feedback will be greatly appreciated, but if you don't want to be notified about beta versions, you can turn off 'Check for beta versions' option and get notified only for the full versions!''. Even you can add it (or link it) in the change log window when asking if you want to upgrade, or at least an explanation on how to turn it off.

The other thing is to make some discussion (and maybe voting) about the things you plan to implement in the next round before it begins. That way you can squeeze the most desired features from the ToDo list and focus mainly on them prior to and during the round. E.g. after all about v2.14 is clear, you may start a new topic and pinpoint the most likely features for the next beta phase (apart from those you consider mandatory) so the users can give their opinion (and make other suggestions as well) and when the time comes you announce what's gonna be implemented at that point and we all focus on that. Any (worthy) suggestions made after the beginning of the beta phase (except some minor ones of course) would be subject to the discussion prior to the next beta phase. That way hopefully the load on you will decrease and the time for the new release will be shorter (if things go as expected of course), giving you more time tolerance for occasional tricky problems like the one with the tab contents.

Probably some of these thoughts have already crossed your mind but anyway I'll be happy to hear your opinion and maybe some even better ideas will come up :)
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Kukurykus
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Re: XMBC 2.14 Beta

Post by Kukurykus » Sun Oct 02, 2016 12:44 am

I agree with all you said, especially last part of your post. After Phil lately announced 2.14 finally I made my own list of todo list I wanted to post only 2.15 Beta topic show up. Now when you wrote your thoughts I have to say it's best idea if after creating topic for 2.15 Beta Phill post list of things he wanted to implement to XMBC, and then we we had few days to add our ideas to finalize list of these things. Those ideas each day could be added to main topic list and after some discussion with us also some of original ones taken off they were added originally (and replaced with others) or changed somehow a little if Phil found our suggestions are worth of consideration.

This way at the beggining of new Beta stage everyone know what Phil is going to work on. That help him for sure much as we could say our opinion and share our ideas. Then this group of things to do could be devided into 3 groups:

- main things they have to be implemented in first instance, or just some important stuff, including those they were voted by users as most desired or else making XMBC functionality better in some significant way

- those Phil wanted to do from some time, not maybe so necessary comparing to others, plus those users proposed but had mostly be useful for group of individual persons

- some other little things like making for better something what was already done, or correct some mistakes, or else do something other way as current one was considered as not enough good in its shape


Each of these groups could have their max limit, for ex. 5 positions for group. After a week of conversations we all together decided what should be placed in each group, but of course Phil had the last word what of all those things would stay in each group.

I think it let Phil to concentrate on things with more focus from beginning as he had perfect view of that he has to do. Nothing what wouldn't be really neccesary couldn't be added to list meantime, and time for making new versaion of XMBC never again would be so long like in case of 2.14 vesion. From the start day Phil could assume how much time he needed to realize all points, and probably that could be done in 1 - 1,5 month.

To make all more readable, with eavery sub-beta realease beside XMBC was to download the point from list would be cross out in first post of Beta topic, while those points Phil worked on would be highlighted, so when someone don't want even read entire content of current Beta posts (sometimes they are few pages long, a little not expected for someone who just registered and want to help), he could check the first post of topic to see what was already done and what Phil is working on. That person could say their notes to things done but with found bugs, say something about progress of 'highlighted' points or say their suggestions of things they weren't started yet but are sill on list of 3 groups of 5 points.
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phil
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Re: XMBC 2.14 Beta

Post by phil » Sun Oct 02, 2016 2:16 pm

Well.......

Maybe - Maybe not. There are a couple of things I want to do in the next beta, but I'm not sure I want to commit to anything up front. And I'm certainly not going to make any promises on time scales - XMBC gets my time as and when I can spare some - its not something I can afford to have any hard timescales/deadlines. Sometimes (if I'm really motivated) I will stay up half the night trying to fix something but its not generally a good thing to do :).

The things on my todo list for 2.15 are:
  • Properly fix any drawing issues
  • Fix auto-switch layer bug, causing it to switch at the wrong time when manually switching layers.
  • Change movement to scroll -> Single entry and configuration window, including ability to not block original button & configure sensitivity.
  • Ability to set a different action to click or click and hold (if at all possible)
  • Fix issues with simulated keys for {LAYER:Next} and {LAYER:Previous}
  • Ability to customize the change movement to scroll cursor/icon
  • Update the installer to use the newly released NSIS 3.0 instead of NSIS 2.x
And that's about it. There is plenty more to consider but those are top of the pile!

Phil
--[ Phil ]--
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Re: XMBC 2.14 Beta

Post by Kukurykus » Sun Oct 02, 2016 2:40 pm

This is not a dedicated 2.15 topic but if there is some list of things to do and that I wrote before could be considered just in some little part I'm posting few another points (perhaps not important for everyone, but maybe because people didn't imagine it can be helpful in their workflow).


What I'd like to have in XMBC 2.15 (I could test in its Beta version to share my opinion):

- executing applications from Simulated Keys by their system paths (for ex. {run:c/somefolder/someapp.exe}) and doing the same for those more popular typing for ex. {run:notepad}

- abillity to store in "Application / Window Profiles" more than one profile of the same application. For example I use XMBC with Photoshop where I have different sets of scripts, depending what kind of work I have to do. To every set I bound other XMBC Photoshop profile with its XMBC layers. Problem is when I have to change the work I do in Photoshop for other project (what my boss want me to do few times each day). I simply replace set of my Photoshop scripts in no time, but to do the same in XMBC I have to remove current XMBC Photoshop Profile and then load from my folder other one I need in that moment (I have many of them depending what kind of work I have to do in Photoshop). It would be much more convinient if I could tick off one XMBC profile to tick on other one.

- if there was access to more than one application profile in "Application / Window Profiles" then it could be done by for ex. two ways:
1) dividing them (groups) by lines (like now it's in XMBC version 2.14) groups were each contains other layer sets of the same application.
2) making a tree of folders, where each app. with more than one profiles had own folder with its profiles, while those that user doesn't need to have with more than one profile could be only tickable*
* Someone could say it's pointless as I could use layers for set of my photoshop scripts. Not true, as in one XMBC Photoshop profile I use more than one XMBC layer.

- possibility to sort applications in Profiles Window. For ex. When I open XMBC then there is alyways selected Default Profile (as default one is on top). If I could sort them and save changes before leaving XMBC, then next time I opened XMBC, an app. profile I use the most often could be alredy top one (or not on top but choosen like during last visit in XMBC), so on the right panel I had quick access to its buttons / layers.
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phil
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Re: XMBC 2.14 Beta

Post by phil » Sun Oct 02, 2016 5:44 pm

Thanks,

The first one, (executing apps from simkeys) - I will add to the list.

The rest, I'm afraid is too big a change or not appropriate...
2. More than one application per profile - Discussed before - it would mean basically starting from scratch and I'm just not willing to entertain that idea right now - sorry! I will see about having profiles with the same name but only one ticked at a time...

3. Sorting the list (discussed with others before) - not a good idea - the list is in the order XMBC actually checks for the active profile - if you sorted it you would have no idea how XMBC may have detected a particular profile - this is very important for per-window profiles (much less for for per application).

But your right, this is not the place to discuss future changes - I should make a new thread for that or perhaps a whole new sub-forum!
--[ Phil ]--
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injtsvetkov
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Re: XMBC 2.14 Beta

Post by injtsvetkov » Mon Oct 03, 2016 3:29 am

phil wrote:I'm not sure I want to commit to anything up front. And I'm certainly not going to make any promises on time scales - XMBC gets my time as and when I can spare some - its not something I can afford to have any hard timescales/deadlines.
It's not about committing or making promises, actually it's just the opposite :). The way I see it (though the idea is not quite clear in my head), the discussion will mostly be about the order of the implementations, new ideas and their refinement and other things regarding the next beta phase, so it would be easier for you to make plans and prepare and chose an appropriate amount of things to implement (of course you can change those as you wish like before). And when you decide the time is right you just say 'Guys, today I start the new beta phase, these are the things to be implemented .....' and we all focus on them and leave the other things and the new suggestions for the next discussion. The idea is to make beta phases more predictable, sharp and to the point, minimizing the potential for error (or piling up of errors). I think that fast, strictly planned beta phases with less implementations are better than long and exhausting ones which often end up with some bugs. It's like putting the beta phase into some frame that all users should know about and stick to that frame while testing and giving feedback, and the new suggestions would go to the discussion thread for the next round.

Now here is an example of a discussion :):
Looking at those 6 points you described for 2.15, I feel kinda strange about the 'Ability to set a different action to click or click and hold (if at all possible)'. I think that one is risky and could lead to unexpected issues, so it might be better to leave it (as a primary feature) for the next round together with some else minor and more predictable things. That way if something goes wrong in the beginning of the beta phase you'll have plenty of time to tackle it without rushing things because you will be prepared for that scenario. And on the other hand, as the 2.15 phase would probably be fast and easy, we'll have plenty of time to discuss that 'click and hold' feature and make our suggestions prior to implementation, coz how were things till now: You decide to do something without sharing it to anybody. After you do it, we see it and start making suggestions so you end up changing what you've already done. So you scratch some of the time spent to do it and then spend some more time to change it. It's true that sometimes you have to see something before you can discuss it, but I believe that there will be plenty of cases that a preliminary discussion will allow you to better imagine things and have a clear picture in your mind about what to do and where to start so the time and effort would be minimal.

As I've said before Phil, my idea is to try to decrease the load/stress on you in every way we can and help you work as smoothly as possible, but you are the one to tell us how exactly to do that. Not that there is any significant help we could offer you but still, the way I see it, the more we help - the more features we get :)

P.S. A new sub-forum about future changes would be better, so every major change would have its own thread...

Thanks
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Re: XMBC 2.14 Beta

Post by BriHecato » Mon Oct 03, 2016 9:08 am

(Un)fortunatelly there's no issues currently with XMBC so I do not know what to write about :D
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phil
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Re: XMBC 2.14 Beta

Post by phil » Mon Oct 03, 2016 11:00 am

BriHecato wrote:(Un)fortunatelly there's no issues currently with XMBC so I do not know what to write about :D
Thats good :)
injtsvetkov wrote: I feel kinda strange about the 'Ability to set a different action to click or click and hold (if at all possible)'. I think that one is risky and could lead to unexpected issues, so it might be better to leave it (as a primary feature) for the next round together with some else minor and more predictable things.
Yes I know and I'm a bit wary on this one - its just there are quite a lot of people asking for sch functionality, here (not in the beta thread) and by email.

I'll see about setting up a sub-forum, but the problem with that is people wont use it and I'll be forever managing/moving posts on the forum :?

Phil
--[ Phil ]--
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Re: XMBC 2.14 Beta

Post by injtsvetkov » Mon Oct 03, 2016 1:43 pm

phil wrote:Yes I know and I'm a bit wary on this one - its just there are quite a lot of people asking for sch functionality, here (not in the beta thread) and by email.
Well then bring it up! Can't wait to see how it's gonna look like :)
phil wrote:I'll see about setting up a sub-forum, but the problem with that is people wont use it and I'll be forever managing/moving posts on the forum :?
I guess so :?. Maybe it would be better to start with just a pre-beta thread for now and see how it goes. Obviously it's late for pre-2.15 now but maybe for the next one ...
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Re: XMBC 2.14 Beta

Post by phil » Mon Oct 03, 2016 11:03 pm

OK I'm going to lock down this thread now.
Please continue discussion and testing over here in the 2.15 Beta thread.

Thanks everyone!
--[ Phil ]--
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